Author Topic: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)  (Read 34793 times)

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #45 on: March 22, 2016, 06:58:50 PM »
Because a "reply' knows where the original request came from.  Gateway is needed when a device inititiates the conversation.


A reply only knows the original source of the packet not the route the packet needs to take. Replies need a route just like any other packet. It is very common for the route to a host be different than a route from a host and for the route to even change between packets. Everybody only knows the next hop in the route not the full route.


In this case because the Pixlite is directly connected to the FPP, the FPP will see any packet put on the wire by the Pixlite and it will know what to do with the packet. This is very similar behavior to ProxyARP where the FPP advertises itself as the destination for anybody asking for a destination next hop via ARP. If there was a switch in-between the Pixlite and the FPP you would need to specifically turn on ProxyARP in the FPP to get the same behavior (echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/conf/eth0/proxy_arp) since the switch would filter the traffic the FPP would see.


Good to know because, I may well want to control more than one PixeLite from the same Pi and have to introduce a switch.

ProxyARP shouldn't been needed, but if it is I'm leaving this here as reference only:

If you do give it try let us know what happens.  To make the ProxyArp persistent across reboots you can add the following line to the bottom of /etc/sysctl.conf:

Code: [Select]
net.ipv4.conf.eth0.proxy_arp = 1
« Last Edit: March 23, 2016, 09:33:54 AM by ThreeSizes »

"And what happened then? Well, in Whoville they say that the Grinch's small heart grew three sizes that day."

Offline pixelpuppy

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #46 on: March 22, 2016, 08:16:39 PM »
Because a "reply' knows where the original request came from.  Gateway is needed when a device inititiates the conversation.
A reply only knows the original source of the packet not the route the packet needs to take. Replies need a route just like any other packet. It is very common for the route to a host be different than a route from a host and for the route to even change between packets. Everybody only knows the next hop in the route not the full route.

In this case because the Pixlite is directly connected to the FPP, the FPP will see any packet put on the wire by the Pixlite and it will know what to do with the packet. This is very similar behavior to ProxyARP where the FPP advertises itself as the destination for anybody asking for a destination next hop via ARP. If there was a switch in-between the Pixlite and the FPP you would need to specifically turn on ProxyARP in the FPP to get the same behavior (echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/conf/eth0/proxy_arp) since the switch would filter the traffic the FPP would see.

That's not what's happening.  The pixlite being directly connected to the FPP has nothing to do with it.  The Pixlite works the same way in other environments that don't have directly connected FPP and there is no proxy ARP enabled.  And it works the same way if there is a switch in the middle.  And it will still work if the ping came from off the LAN through a gateway.


The reply knows the requestor's  IP address AND it knows the MAC address of the packet that contained the request.   IF the request came from on the lan then the MAC is the address of the originator and that's where the reply gets sent  IF the request originated off the LAN then the MAC is the address of the gateway and gets sent back to the gateway for routing off the lan.  Therefore, the reply DOES know where to send the answer, regardless of whether the originator is on the same lan or not.   No proxy needed.


There are LOTS of IP enabled devices in the world that have no gateway configuration setting. If I remember, the SANDevices controllers are this way as well (no gateway setting). These are devices that do not initiatate an IP connection, they only answer or reply to incoming IP requests.  The simple IP stack sends the reply back to the MAC address of the packet that contained the request.  That's all it needs. 


The fact that the Pixlite being directly connected to the FPP is NOT the reason it answers.  This is NOT proxy ARP.   And it does not matter if they are direct connected or if there is a switch between them.  It still works because the reply goes back to the MAC address of the packet that contained the originating request.  This works the same if they are direct connected or through a switch.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 08:31:39 PM by pixelpuppy »
xLights and Vixen3 for sequencing / FPP for scheduling and playing / Falcon controllers for pixels / DIY controllers for everything else

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #47 on: March 22, 2016, 08:30:33 PM »
Because a "reply' knows where the original request came from.  Gateway is needed when a device inititiates the conversation.
A reply only knows the original source of the packet not the route the packet needs to take. Replies need a route just like any other packet. It is very common for the route to a host be different than a route from a host and for the route to even change between packets. Everybody only knows the next hop in the route not the full route.

In this case because the Pixlite is directly connected to the FPP, the FPP will see any packet put on the wire by the Pixlite and it will know what to do with the packet. This is very similar behavior to ProxyARP where the FPP advertises itself as the destination for anybody asking for a destination next hop via ARP. If there was a switch in-between the Pixlite and the FPP you would need to specifically turn on ProxyARP in the FPP to get the same behavior (echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/conf/eth0/proxy_arp) since the switch would filter the traffic the FPP would see.

That's not what's happening.  The pixlite being directly connected to the FPP has nothing to do with it.  The Pixlite works the same way in other environments that don't have directly connected FPP and there is no proxy ARP enabled.  And it works the same way if there is a switch in the middle. 


The reply knows the requestor's  IP address AND it knows the MAC address of the packet that contained the request.   IF the request came from on the lan then the MAC is the address of the originator and that's where the reply gets sent  IF the request originated off the LAN then the MAC is the address of the gateway and gets sent back to the gateway for routing off the lan.  Therefore, the reply DOES know where to send the answer, regardless of whether the originator is on the same lan or not.   No proxy needed.


There are LOTS of IP enabled devices in the world that have no gateway configuration setting. If I remember, the SANDevices controllers are this way as well (no gateway setting). These are devices that do not initiatate an IP connection, they only answer or reply to incoming IP requests.  The simple IP stack sends the reply back to the MAC address of the packet that contained the request.  That's all it needs. 


The fact that the Pixlite being directly connected to the FPP is NOT the reason it answers.  This is NOT proxy ARP.   And it does not matter if they are direct connected or if there is a switch between them.  It still works because the reply goes back to the MAC address of the packet that contained the originating request.  This works the same if they are direct connected or through a switch.


Agreed. It's been a long time since I dealt with the simpler IP stacks, thanks for refresher.






Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #48 on: March 23, 2016, 09:35:40 AM »
Agreed. It's been a long time since I dealt with the simpler IP stacks, thanks for refresher.


I cleaned up a few of the previous posts to reflect the corrected information provided by PixelPuppy to avoid future confusion. I've also added a couple of additional words to the first post of the thread as well.




Offline abolton

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #49 on: May 20, 2016, 12:18:38 AM »
I've been having some problems talking to the controller from my PC as well using Option 1. Wlan is set to 192.168.10.20. eth0 is 192.168.20.10 which I can ping but I cannot ping the controller 192.168.20.11 with a gateway of 192.168.20.10, SN /24 for all. I setup a route; host IP 191.168.20.0 ---> GW 192.168.10.20. Still cannot ping. When I set an additional route for 192.168.20.0 ----> Gateway 192.168.10.1 (Router Address), I can ping. I know it was stated that if you set the controllers GW to the router address it may break down the line but I'm not clear if I'm essentially doing the same thing just from the other direction or if I needed this additional route to be able to complete all the hops needed? Anyone have any ideas on this setup?


Well found one mistake - still having issues connecting to the interface though.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2016, 12:34:30 AM by abolton »

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #50 on: May 20, 2016, 04:59:34 PM »
I've been having some problems talking to the controller from my PC as well using Option 1. Wlan is set to 192.168.10.20. eth0 is 192.168.20.10 which I can ping but I cannot ping the controller 192.168.20.11 with a gateway of 192.168.20.10, SN /24 for all. I setup a route; host IP 191.168.20.0 ---> GW 192.168.10.20. Still cannot ping. When I set an additional route for 192.168.20.0 ----> Gateway 192.168.10.1 (Router Address), I can ping. I know it was stated that if you set the controllers GW to the router address it may break down the line but I'm not clear if I'm essentially doing the same thing just from the other direction or if I needed this additional route to be able to complete all the hops needed? Anyone have any ideas on this setup?


Well found one mistake - still having issues connecting to the interface though.


If you want to recap your issue after correcting the mistake, I'd be glad to help.




Offline abolton

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #51 on: May 20, 2016, 10:50:22 PM »
Thanks ThreeSizes and thanks to everyone else - Sadly I must admit I completely forgot to hook the patch cable back up to the Ethernet port after testing wireless. After correcting that I went back through and changed everything back to match up to the process and now I'm able to connect to the interface and FPP is driving the controller.


Thanks Again!

Offline jholmes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #52 on: June 09, 2016, 01:14:04 AM »
Continuing the latest question regarding a PixLite controller and the Advatek Assistant.
Why do you think the AA cannot see the device when it is behind an FPP?


Here is a screen-shot of my AA window. You can see the IP is currently in the same subnet as my "adapter" (aka my wifi) but that is because I connected it directly to the router, bypassing the pi. When I change the IP and connect it behind the FPP, the Advatek software can no longer see it.


Funny enough, if I do connect the PixLite directly to the router and the IP address is in the wrong subnet, Advatek will STILL see the device, warn me of the IP issue, and prompt me to fix it.


Your thoughts are GREATLY appreciated.

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #53 on: June 09, 2016, 07:05:22 AM »
Continuing the latest question regarding a PixLite controller and the Advatek Assistant.
Why do you think the AA cannot see the device when it is behind an FPP?


Here is a screen-shot of my AA window. You can see the IP is currently in the same subnet as my "adapter" (aka my wifi) but that is because I connected it directly to the router, bypassing the pi. When I change the IP and connect it behind the FPP, the Advatek software can no longer see it.


Funny enough, if I do connect the PixLite directly to the router and the IP address is in the wrong subnet, Advatek will STILL see the device, warn me of the IP issue, and prompt me to fix it.


Your thoughts are GREATLY appreciated.


I'm not familiar with the PixLite/AA and your screenshot didn't make it to the post. The first thing that comes to my mind given your last statement is the AA is doing some sort of local network discovery/communication at the ethernet layer (layer 2). Anything at the layer 2 is not routable and would not transit the FPP. This is way it can see the PixLite and complain about its IP address being incorrect.








Offline uzelessknowledge

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #54 on: August 08, 2016, 08:53:17 PM »
Can you tell me if this will work?

Home network 192.168.2.x
Show network 192.168.3.x

FPP WLAN 192.268.2.151
FPP eth0 192.168.3.151
F16v2 192.168.3.161

The FPP and f16v2 are connected to the show router. There will eventually be 2 more f16v2 connected to the router.

Can I access the f16v2 from my home network?

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #55 on: August 08, 2016, 09:37:48 PM »
Can you tell me if this will work?

Home network 192.168.2.x
Show network 192.168.3.x

FPP WLAN 192.268.2.151
FPP eth0 192.168.3.151
F16v2 192.168.3.161

The FPP and f16v2 are connected to the show router. There will eventually be 2 more f16v2 connected to the router.

Can I access the f16v2 from my home network?


In theory yes, but it depends on whether or not you can get the routing properly setup on the home router and whether you can disable NAT on the show router. I was just emailed back and forth with jnealand on a similar setup. We ran into a problem with the home router not properly handling the routes and the show router not able to disable NAT.


We can get into specifics, but this is what you want to try to do:


On the home router, setup routes 192.168.2.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X and 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X. (where 192.168.1.X is the IP address of the show router)
On the show router, setup route 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.151 and disable NAT.
On the FPP 192.168.2.151 make sure Enable Forwarding is checked in Network Setup and ETH0 has no gateway and WLAN0 has gateway of 192.168.2.1.
On the F16V2 make sure 192.168.3.151 is configured for the gateway.






Offline uzelessknowledge

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #56 on: August 08, 2016, 09:45:12 PM »
Can you tell me if this will work?

Home network 192.168.2.x
Show network 192.168.3.x

FPP WLAN 192.268.2.151
FPP eth0 192.168.3.151
F16v2 192.168.3.161

The FPP and f16v2 are connected to the show router. There will eventually be 2 more f16v2 connected to the router.

Can I access the f16v2 from my home network?


In theory yes, but it depends on whether or not you can get the routing properly setup on the home router and whether you can disable NAT on the show router. I was just emailed back and forth with jnealand on a similar setup. We ran into a problem with the home router not properly handling the routes and the show router not able to disable NAT.


We can get into specifics, but this is what you want to try to do:


On the home router, setup routes 192.168.2.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X and 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X. (where 192.168.1.X is the IP address of the show router)
On the show router, setup route 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.151 and disable NAT.
On the FPP 192.168.2.151 make sure Enable Forwarding is checked in Network Setup and ETH0 has no gateway and WLAN0 has gateway of 192.168.2.1.
On the F16V2 make sure 192.168.3.151 is configured for the gateway.
Headed to bed and saw this.
Show router is 192.168.3.140. Didn't mention that. Where is the 192.168.1.x coming from?

Also, home router is an AirPort Extreme and doesn't allow static routes :(

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #57 on: August 08, 2016, 10:25:11 PM »
Can you tell me if this will work?

Home network 192.168.2.x
Show network 192.168.3.x

FPP WLAN 192.268.2.151
FPP eth0 192.168.3.151
F16v2 192.168.3.161

The FPP and f16v2 are connected to the show router. There will eventually be 2 more f16v2 connected to the router.

Can I access the f16v2 from my home network?


In theory yes, but it depends on whether or not you can get the routing properly setup on the home router and whether you can disable NAT on the show router. I was just emailed back and forth with jnealand on a similar setup. We ran into a problem with the home router not properly handling the routes and the show router not able to disable NAT.


We can get into specifics, but this is what you want to try to do:


On the home router, setup routes 192.168.2.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X and 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.1.X. (where 192.168.1.X is the IP address of the show router)
On the show router, setup route 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.151 and disable NAT.
On the FPP 192.168.2.151 make sure Enable Forwarding is checked in Network Setup and ETH0 has no gateway and WLAN0 has gateway of 192.168.2.1.
On the F16V2 make sure 192.168.3.151 is configured for the gateway.
Headed to bed and saw this.
Show router is 192.168.3.140. Didn't mention that. Where is the 192.168.1.x coming from?

Also, home router is an AirPort Extreme and doesn't allow static routes :(


Sorry I was headed to bed myself and should have kept going and waited for morning.  I seemed to have imagined an entirely different network for you.


You have two options: if you can disable NAT on the show router you can route through it to get to the F16V2, otherwise, you can also route through the FPP.


Option #1: Disable NAT on the show router, configure the F16V2 (or anything else you want to access) with a gateway of 192.168.3.140, and add a route to the computer you want to access the F16V2. The route you want is 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.X (whatever the WAN address of the show router is).


Option #2: Enable Forwarding on the FPP, configure the F16V2 (or anything else you want to access) with a gateway of 192.168.3.151, and add a route to the computer you want to access the F16V2. The route you want for this option is 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.151.


The command to the add the route to the computer varies depending on O/S and you can find them back on like the third port on this thread.




Offline uzelessknowledge

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #58 on: August 09, 2016, 06:33:02 AM »
Sorry I was headed to bed myself and should have kept going and waited for morning.  I seemed to have imagined an entirely different network for you.


You have two options: if you can disable NAT on the show router you can route through it to get to the F16V2, otherwise, you can also route through the FPP.


Option #1: Disable NAT on the show router, configure the F16V2 (or anything else you want to access) with a gateway of 192.168.3.140, and add a route to the computer you want to access the F16V2. The route you want is 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.X (whatever the WAN address of the show router is).


Option #2: Enable Forwarding on the FPP, configure the F16V2 (or anything else you want to access) with a gateway of 192.168.3.151, and add a route to the computer you want to access the F16V2. The route you want for this option is 192.168.3.0 255.255.255.0 via 192.168.2.151.


The command to the add the route to the computer varies depending on O/S and you can find them back on like the third port on this thread.

Option 1: Not sure this will work. Show router is stand alone and not connected to home network. Show router is outside with no Ethernet back into the house. I didn't want to have to feed one and I didn't want someone to be able to come plug in from outside and be able to get to my network. I know I'm paranoid.

Option 2: Sounds like this will work. I will only be able to use a computer though to get to the F16v2 and can't use iPhone, right?

Hey, thanks for the help. Good to have someone with your knowledge available.

Offline ThreeSizes

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Re: FPP WiFi Setup (Originally Master + Remotes + WiFi How-To)
« Reply #59 on: August 09, 2016, 08:03:41 AM »

Option 2: Sounds like this will work. I will only be able to use a computer though to get to the F16v2 and can't use iPhone, right?

Hey, thanks for the help. Good to have someone with your knowledge available.


Yes, only things connected to the home network that can setup routes. For the iPhone you could always just temporally connect it to the show network WiFi if you need to get to it from the iPhone.




 

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