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Just putting this out for research?

Started by Ronnie McCathern, August 16, 2022, 08:14:44 PM

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Ronnie McCathern

Putting this out here to see where we go from here in this hobby! It seems that with every new version of controller that gets put out. They get further away from the root cause for there use, and are turning into a light show all in one! So far we are up to the " light controller" being the fm transmitter, Wi-Fi router, show computer, stand alone input receivers, and a lot of other things I can't even remember! I am just seeing if the market would be there for just no frills pixel controllers!  ::)

k6ccc

Yea, there are lots of those.  Falcons, SanDevices, Alphapix, LOR, and many others.
Using LOR (mostly SuperStar) for all sequencing - using FPP only to drive P5 and P10 panels.
My show website:  http://newburghlights.org

Jim

Ronnie McCathern

I think you missed the point of what I am asking. Yes they all control the pixels, but charge you a included price for "add on's" some of us will never use! It's fine say having one do it all controller, but what about the rest of them? Should it be a master show controller in ever box at every mega tree, line of arches, house outline, and so forth. I have been doing these displays since 2013 using falcons ( which seems is selling off inventory to close as no new controllers in months.) and light a Rama controllers and not once has the thought of linking my entire show to just one controller crossed my mind. Nor have I ever found a use for the WiFi or broadcasting features on any of them! I basically pay a ballpark price for what I need, and then a lot extra for a bunch of fillers! My concern is this. After speaking with a lot of people, the hobby has just gotten to expensive for your average first timer's, so why not offer a no frills controller to them and let them slowly get into the hobby like we all did. Happy Holidays my friend! 

k6ccc

I think you are reading far more into some of the specs.  Essentially none of the controllers I listed have any of the capabilities you say are all included - or are EXCEEDINGLY limited.  None of them have built in FM transmitters.  None have a show computer.  None have a built in WiFi router (a few have limited WiFi capability).  A couple have limited capability to control another controller.

The closest to a truly dumb E1.31 pixel controller that I know of is the SanDevices line - which in my opinion are very nice controllers, although by todays standards are somewhat limited (used them for years).  The LOR Pixie line have NONE of the "extra" capabilities that you talk about (although note that they are LOR protocol only - not E1.31).  LOR designed them as a simple pixel controller with the specific intent of a simple to configure and inexpensive pixel controller.

As far as finding inexpensive controllers, it's not all that hard to find low end controllers on the used market as people move up - some at almost give away prices.
Using LOR (mostly SuperStar) for all sequencing - using FPP only to drive P5 and P10 panels.
My show website:  http://newburghlights.org

Jim

rayster

Good points Jim. What I find interesting is some one that has been it the hobby since 2013 only has 4 post and is a newbie saying the that Falcon's are going away. The silicon shortage has made it very hard for small manufactures to make what they want to build. 

Pre covid you could start up for about $50 using the a PI-Cap and a RPi zero. Now RPi can not get the chips they need. If you can find a Pi anywhere they are marked way up in price.

Ray
Ray
Using K8-B, Rpi 3b w/PiHat, Rpi 3b+ w/ PiHat, K4-PB

Poporacer

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMI think you missed the point of what I am asking. Yes they all control the pixels, but charge you a included price for "add on's" some of us will never use!
Have you seen all of the requests for "all-in-one" controller boxes? It looks like they are filling a need. Do you use every feature on your vacuum cleaner, in your car?

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMShould it be a master show controller in ever box at every mega tree, line of arches, house outline, and so forth.
No, and there are options for that, look at the K40 and F48.

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMwhich seems is selling off inventory to close as no new controllers in months
He has had controllers several times throughout the year, he can't control the Worldwide chip shortage, governmental shutdowns, port of entry congestion and backlogs......
It the Raspberry Pi Foundation disbanding too? Have you tried to find one of those lately?

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMand not once has the thought of linking my entire show to just one controller crossed my mind.
But hundreds of others have and that is why those controllers are on high demand.

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMNor have I ever found a use for the WiFi or broadcasting features on any of them!
But then again, you are in the small minority and adding that convenience only adds about $5 to the cost, whether that cost is partially absorbed by the vendor or totally put on the buyer's shoulder, who knows.

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMI basically pay a ballpark price for what I need, and then a lot extra for a bunch of fillers!
But that is your choice, you don't have to. And these "fillers" really don't really add that much to the controller cost and carrying multiple variations of controllers with different levels of "fillers" would cost the consumer more in the long run.

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMAfter speaking with a lot of people, the hobby has just gotten to expensive for your average first timer's,
But you are aware that there is a HUGE Worldwide chip shortage and inflation going on right now? For example, the Raspberry Pis were readily available and in constant stock in every store for $35-$45. Tell me how much you can buy one for TODAY? If you can find one, it will probably be double the price. Controllers have not increased anywhere near that.

Quote from: Ronnie McCathern on August 17, 2022, 08:40:23 AMso why not offer a no frills controller to them and let them slowly get into the hobby like we all did.
But there ARE tons of those out there...just look! 
There is a potential problem with that concept, a "no-frills" controller will fit the needs for today, but tomorrow, next year, etc., might not work so now they actually need a controller that has some more features and the price paid for that "no-frills" controller was wasted.
The bottom line is that what you are asking/proposing is pretty much out there already.
If to err is human, I am more human than most people.

Ronnie McCathern

Rather than waste my time arguing with a fan boy of certain things. Let me put it this way. Since I started in this hobby it has been let's just add everything we can to each ' new version' of each model of controller and make it cost more! I can understand loads of people in this hobby probably lack the basic skills to make custom cables and props and need to use Wi-Fi for connecting their controllers, but why take away processing power for something unused (keep on adding functions and even a falcon want even be able to due a mere 20 fps)! Or wait until some jerk comes near it with a high powered CB radio ( fire truck, cops, ambulance, red neck ) and disrupts the whole display which happened to me the one time I tried using WI-FI for a quick halloween display. I can even understand the want for on board fm transmitters, I mean it's just one more part of your display gone if the controller dies, which I would assume all you super cookie cutter display pros have had happen at least once. But to be honest I was only asking for input from this group if the simplest of controllers would still have a place in the market, I wasn't really looking to find the same asinine insulting condescending comments and ignorant remarks here as in the Facebook groups, but I guess there's only so many people interested in this hobby or are willing to be downed all the time by fools on ego trips. Live and learn I guess, which is why I and many others avoid these forms and groups to start with! For a hobby meant to bring joy people, it's main town squares are filled with some of the most disgusting narcissistic people one could imagine out there! Y'all take care! No need to reply because I will not be back on these forms again!

k6ccc

Ronnie,  I'm largely trying to figure out what you are talking about.  For example, you talk about controllers having a built in FM transmitter.  Name one that does.  I am not aware of any controller that has a built in FM transmitter.
I gave you a list of several very simple pixel controllers in two different posts that have none of the "added features", and you apparently ignored that information.
BTW, none of the responses were insulting or condescending.
Using LOR (mostly SuperStar) for all sequencing - using FPP only to drive P5 and P10 panels.
My show website:  http://newburghlights.org

Jim

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