News:

LATEST RELEASE:  FPP 6.1 - Download from here - https://github.com/FalconChristmas/fpp/releases/tag/6.1

+-+-

+-User

Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register.
 
 
 
Forgot your password?

+-Site Stats

Members
Total Members: 15461
Latest: kevuk77
New This Month: 84
New This Week: 38
New Today: 5
Stats
Total Posts: 126752
Total Topics: 15531
Most Online Today: 139
Most Online Ever: 7634
(January 21, 2020, 02:14:03 AM)
Users Online
Members: 6
Guests: 93
Total: 99

5mm LED Pixels

Started by CarterM, January 10, 2018, 07:20:36 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

CarterM

My wife and I have different ideas about what looks good for a display.  I don't care what it looks like during the day... she does!  So we all know where that gets us :)


She likes a lot of the static display elements, and love the accents I'll do with pixels - but doesn't want to see coro or wires if we can help it.  In that spirit, I've been looking for ways to compromise - namely, how can I retrofit these static display elements with pixels so it's not just an A/C controlled prop?


After tear-down I started digging on how small of a pixel I can get.  I'd love to put the 'fairy lights' out in a lot of places, but those are a different beast.  I then stumbled on some 5mm LED's that actually have the IC built into the LED light itself!  I've got a few on the way now to experiment with, but after talking to Ray he magically has the same listing I bought from someone else on his site now:


https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Flat-hat-WS2812D-5mm-RGB-WS2811-LEDs-RGB-full-color-with-WS2811-IC-built-in/701799_32696884482.html?spm=2114.12010612.0.0.6f930e7aWenBjs


You can get these in the 'flat top' as well as the frosted/rounded.


My question - has anyone else ventured down this path already?  I'm not sure how new these are.  It just blows me away that they can get the IC in the actual LED...


My vision is to retrofit props that use standard 5mm LED's with these.  I'll have to waterproof them and such, but I have ideas on how to get that done.  At $0.10-0.12/ea, it'll be a fun, inexpensive project.  Or so I think...

Bwinter

Quote from: CarterM on January 10, 2018, 07:20:36 AM
My wife and I have different ideas about what looks good for a display.  I don't care what it looks like during the day... she does!  So we all know where that gets us :)


She likes a lot of the static display elements, and love the accents I'll do with pixels - but doesn't want to see coro or wires if we can help it.  In that spirit, I've been looking for ways to compromise - namely, how can I retrofit these static display elements with pixels so it's not just an A/C controlled prop?


After tear-down I started digging on how small of a pixel I can get.  I'd love to put the 'fairy lights' out in a lot of places, but those are a different beast.  I then stumbled on some 5mm LED's that actually have the IC built into the LED light itself!  I've got a few on the way now to experiment with, but after talking to Ray he magically has the same listing I bought from someone else on his site now:


https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Flat-hat-WS2812D-5mm-RGB-WS2811-LEDs-RGB-full-color-with-WS2811-IC-built-in/701799_32696884482.html?spm=2114.12010612.0.0.6f930e7aWenBjs


You can get these in the 'flat top' as well as the frosted/rounded.


My question - has anyone else ventured down this path already?  I'm not sure how new these are.  It just blows me away that they can get the IC in the actual LED...


My vision is to retrofit props that use standard 5mm LED's with these.  I'll have to waterproof them and such, but I have ideas on how to get that done.  At $0.10-0.12/ea, it'll be a fun, inexpensive project.  Or so I think...

Yeah, I spent a lot of time playing with these last.  Both the APA and the PL versions.

CarterM

Any issues?  Do they work just as well as 'normal' pixels?

Bwinter

Quote from: CarterM on January 10, 2018, 08:34:23 AM
Any issues?  Do they work just as well as 'normal' pixels?

Yes and no. I ordered small batches from several different vendors. One version popped/smoked every time I applied power (I went through 10).  Im curious which model you ordered.

The others did work fine.  You may need to consider a capacitor, as these don't have ones built-in (like all the normal strips/bullets we're accustomed to).

I did have some weird issues with daisy-chaining the data. For the most part, it works.  But in one configuration (critical, for my application), it simply didn't work (for reasons I still can't comprehend).

I still have inventory that I'm sitting in, and have some ideas that I'm working on for next year, to use these again.

CarterM

I got 100 of these:


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Flat-hat-WS2812D-led-chip-5mm-RGB-WS2811-LEDs-DIP-F5mm-RGB-full-color-with-WS2811/32845540147.html


and 100 of these:


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5-1000pcs-DC5V-Diffused-round-hat-RGB-LED-with-WS2811-chipset-inside-5mm-F5-8mm-F8/32713415299.html


I also don't mind building a small box/device in the prop to handle small design issues - I'm going to build out a test setup on my breadboard and use an ESPixelStick initially...maybe my RaPi/Adrino... my hope is they don't require a lot of extra work.  Ray also has these:


https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/100pcs-string-addressable-PL9823-F5-led-string-DC5V-input-3cm-wire-spacing-with-all-black-wire/701799_32651932855.html?spm=2114.12010612.0.0.264c9f03nHUhZM


While I don't care about the wire, they might present a next-best-solution if this one doesn't pan out for me.




Bwinter

Interesting WS2812D.  Those aren't the types I've used, but are probably the same thing.  Do you have the pin-out?

Bwinter

Quote from: Bwinter on January 10, 2018, 10:46:22 AM
Interesting WS2812D.  Those aren't the types I've used, but are probably the same thing.  Do you have the pin-out?


It looks those might actually be the APA106 or PL??? (which I've used more, but can't remember the model#), just labeled as "WS2812D".

CarterM

I'm actually not 100% sure.


This vendor lists 3 types - PL9823, APA106 and WS2811 and you can pick which one you want (and size/qty of course).


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DC5V-Diffused-round-hat-RGB-LED-with-WS2811-PL9823-APA106-chipset-inside-5mm-8mm-Neo-pixel/32825363423.html


Pin-outs and diagrams are on that page - they all seem to have the same pin-out, and all claim compatibility with WS2811 protocol (just like the 1903 which works off of a Falcon just fine with WS2811 selected).


I'm not an expert, but an experimenter in this one :)

Bwinter

Yes, I played with various versions of PL9823 and APA106 from different vendor (Ebay, Amazon).  I was just experimenting as well

CarterM

Well, I now have samples coming from at least 3 vendors.  This aught to be fun...


I'll reply back once I have some more info and hopefully some functioning LEDs...

corey872

Kind of neat to see an idea come full circle!  http://falconchristmas.com/forum/index.php/topic,681.msg5210.html#msg5210

What would be really nice now is to have these LEDs with a 'socket' type arrangement.  A slight modification of the 'standard' miniature light wiring / socket and a plug adapter on the LED would make changing or replacing bad nodes trivial.

On the data transmission, typically the controller chips have suggested a low value (33 ohm IIRC) series resistor on the data out and data in lines.  This is supposed to help impedance matching between the lines and allows for the standard ~15ft inter-node data transmission distance.   If the 'weird issues daisy chaining' seem to be associated with longer distances between nodes, it could be that they left those resistors out to save a few cents.
Corey

Bwinter

Quote from: corey872 on January 13, 2018, 10:40:23 AM
Kind of neat to see an idea come full circle!  http://falconchristmas.com/forum/index.php/topic,681.msg5210.html#msg5210

What would be really nice now is to have these LEDs with a 'socket' type arrangement.  A slight modification of the 'standard' miniature light wiring / socket and a plug adapter on the LED would make changing or replacing bad nodes trivial.

On the data transmission, typically the controller chips have suggested a low value (33 ohm IIRC) series resistor on the data out and data in lines.  This is supposed to help impedance matching between the lines and allows for the standard ~15ft inter-node data transmission distance.   If the 'weird issues daisy chaining' seem to be associated with longer distances between nodes, it could be that they left those resistors out to save a few cents.

Ah yes, the missing resister certainly could have been my problem.

The "they that left those out," was ME.  I simply didn't know that there should have been a resister used hereā€”and I've not had much luck in finding any sort of user-group for how to implement these LEDs!

Bwinter

Quote from: corey872 on January 13, 2018, 10:40:23 AM
What would be really nice now is to have these LEDs with a 'socket' type arrangement.  A slight modification of the 'standard' miniature light wiring / socket and a plug adapter on the LED would make changing or replacing bad nodes trivial.


And I would CERTAINLY be interested in finding some "socket" type arrangement, or some type of wiring-harness that can be used for these.


I know I could roll my own, but not in an efficient (and solid) method that I would need to process the volume I'm looking into.

CarterM

Quote from: corey872 on January 13, 2018, 10:40:23 AM
Kind of neat to see an idea come full circle!  http://falconchristmas.com/forum/index.php/topic,681.msg5210.html#msg5210

What would be really nice now is to have these LEDs with a 'socket' type arrangement.  A slight modification of the 'standard' miniature light wiring / socket and a plug adapter on the LED would make changing or replacing bad nodes trivial.

On the data transmission, typically the controller chips have suggested a low value (33 ohm IIRC) series resistor on the data out and data in lines.  This is supposed to help impedance matching between the lines and allows for the standard ~15ft inter-node data transmission distance.   If the 'weird issues daisy chaining' seem to be associated with longer distances between nodes, it could be that they left those resistors out to save a few cents.


So Ray sells these as well:





I'm going to get a couple of samples from him, and I'm curious what the boards have on them in these examples.  Perhaps they are just a couple of resistors mounted.


Either way, this is a step towards your idea of a socket.  It would be wonderful to have something as mundane as the current mini-light sockets... and if a pixel burns out, just replace it.  You might even be able to waterproof the connector.


Bwinter

I've seen those as well.  Not really what I'm looking for, and doesn't look even remotely water-resistant.  And in that configuration (pointing opposite direction), I can't really think of an application I would use them for.


I'll be curious to see what others come up with, but based on what I was wanting to use them form--at the end, I really couldn't justify using these over just using a normal strip.  Especially given the amount of time that it would take to get a bunch of these into any working model.

Support FPP

+- Recent Topics

show locks me out of falcon player by JonD
Today at 03:30:44 PM

FPP - Video not playing but audio is by Djphill_2003
Today at 02:56:43 PM

Testing pixel on port 9 not working by JonD
Today at 02:52:17 PM

F16v3 Won't boot or power on by JonD
Today at 02:32:36 PM

Remote Pi connection issues by JonD
Today at 02:07:40 PM

Heads up on display setup by Santacarl
Today at 12:53:31 PM

Using LOR Lightorama and Falcon Smart Receivers together by JonD
Today at 12:47:18 PM

FPP Controlled Power Outlet Suggestions? by Santacarl
Today at 12:35:03 PM

Sequence freeze by JonD
Today at 11:02:31 AM

Enable Routing by Peowraaku
Today at 10:22:09 AM

Powered by EzPortal
Powered by SMFPacks Menu Editor Mod